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The Monkees' Davy Jones Recalls Beatles Friendship and Mike Nesmith's Disloyalty

Shirlaine Forrest, Getty Images

When he appeared on 'The Ed Sullivan Show' with the Beatles in 1964, Davy Jones had no idea he was staring at his future.

On the show, he performed a song from 'Oliver!' the Broadway show he was acting in at the time. But two years later, he'd be cast in 'The Monkees,' a TV show about a band similar to the Beatles and inspired by the Fab Four movie 'A Hard Day's Night.'

Despite its origins as a pretend band, the Monkees became a real one after insisting they play their own instruments and write their own songs. Meanwhile, tunes like 'Daydream Believer,' 'Last Train to Clarksville' and 'I'm a Believer' were smash hits, contributing to Monkeemania.

While the show only lasted two years, the Monkees -- Jones, Micky Dolenz, Peter Tork and Mike Nesmith -- would occasionally reunite. Currently, they are celebrating their 45th year with a tour that doesn't include Nesmith, who opted not to join the band.

Jones recently spoke to Spinner about the reunion and the band's storied past.
　
In the past, you said, "Never, ever, ever again" to a reunion. It's almost like athletes who say they're going to retire but can't keep away.

I said I wouldn't go out without Mike Nesmith. And then I looked at a picture of Mike Nesmith, and he looks like a German banker. And I thought, "There's no way that guy's gonna stand on a stage and be Mike Nesmith of the Monkees." And then a management company came to me and said, "We'd like to take the Monkees out. What do you think?" And I said, "I don't think so -- my schedule's busy." This was last year.

Then, they said, "Can't you please?" I said, "I've got [solo] dates." Then I said, "If you come up with something and Micky and Peter say yes, I'll consider it." Well, Micky was over in England doing 'Hairspray' and I went to see him after he'd done press for the show, and we got along real good. Then we talked and laughed and discussed stuff we'd done.

The Monkees Perform 'Daydream Believer' in 2011
　
Early on, you had a major appearance on 'Ed Sullivan,' which happened to be the same episode the Beatles were on. What was the pressure like for that appearance, knowing the Beatles were on and so many people would be watching?

No pressure whatsoever. I did what I did. I came out the stage door every night, and when I performed as the Artful Dodger and came out for my bow, there was still a great applause. And I thought the 10 kids outside the stage door looking for my autograph after the show was the bee's knees. Then I saw the barricades outside the Ed Sullivan Theater and I'm thinking, "Wow, man."

Afterward, they sent me out to Hollywood many, many times [for auditions]. You know, 'The Wackiest Ship in the Army,' 'Hogan's Heroes,' 'F Troop,' 'Batman' and all that stuff. But just as all that was happening, along came the idea for 'The Monkees,' and the producer, Burt Schneider, his father was the head of Columbia Pictures, so obviously I had a foot in the door there -- I was already signed to Columbia Pictures. We just had to find three other boys, which we did. And we clicked, and we did 56 episodes, and it went to 36 countries around the world, and they're still playing the music, and we're still on tour.

The Beatles would go on to say they were fans of the Monkees. How important was their approval?

It means something that anybody likes us. Paul McCartney called me up in the '60s and asked me to send some stuff to his daughter, who was a fan of the Monkees. And Micky has tapes and videos of George Harrison and Ringo Starr at his house, in the Canyon, in the late '60s, down in his little studio, playing. Those tapes must be great to listen to.

It's great the Beatles loved us.

How did the Monkees get along in the early days?

We'd get on the set, we'd improvise and we'd be laughing so much, the producer would say, "If you don't stop laughing and get on with it, we're closing the set down."

Micky and I and my wife and our children always used to get together on a Sunday when we were doing the Monkees show, either at his pool or my pool. We'd have a barbecue and the kids would swim. We'd all go to a park in the San Fernando Valley, and we'd be playing with Alice Cooper's Vampires. He had a baseball team, and we used to play different teams, local and otherwise. Peter Tork was a great third baseman, Micky Dolenz a great first baseman. I played second base. I don't know where Alice was, but he organized the whole thing.

Even though 'Last Train to Clarksville' was secretly about Vietnam, the Monkees strayed from controversy. Why?

The world was changing, and they were trying to hide the fact that it was. We were told never to talk about politics, never to talk about the war and never to talk about the marches. If I've got any regret whatsoever, it's that I didn't march to Washington with everybody when they did have the civil rights march.

Critics would talk about you guys not meeting organically, but it's really kind of brilliant how a great band was created, playing great songs written by great songwriters.

Don Kirshner supplied the Monkees with tunes from all these great songwriters. But just because he provided the tunes, he can't claim the success of the Monkees. Even some of the songwriters were like, "I wish I had done that song." But they wouldn't have done anything with it, had they done that song. We had a TV show supporting us. DJs were taking the records off the TV that week and playing them on the radio.
　
When the Monkees made their bid for more control, you guys were really still new. It was kind of a bold move for you guys to say, "We want more control." Was there ever a feeling like "Maybe we shouldn't mess with a good thing?"

It wasn't spoiling a good thing. It would have become tiresome.

It was mostly Peter and Mike. But Mike had ulterior motives. Mike had the B-side of every single we did. Therefore, he's driving an El Dorado, and I'm driving a Volkswagen. I'm not aware of any of this -- I'm an actor, employed by a studio. I'm not doing any of that. He knew all about that. If he had spent more time on his acting, that would have been better, but he didn't show up half the time. He wouldn't come in for a show or whatever. And then we find that he's got albums and he's got deals and all that other stuff going on. So Mike never really put his 100 percent into the marriage. He only was on the surface of the marriage. He signed the paper not with us, but with other people. And that's the way he is whenever he's come back. In 1998-1999, we made an album and we went to England, we sold out everywhere. We arranged to meet in January for a week's rehearsal, and he just didn't show up.
　
You went from being an establishment-created band to anti-establishment in that you rebelled against it. Is that what gave you cred among rock fans?

I don't think we ever really rebelled against it. We asked for things that they hadn't considered. We never considered that Micky Dolenz and I would be driving down the street to a rented house after we made the pilot, and all of the sudden 'Last Train to Clarksville' comes on the radio. We had never thought about it going on the radio. It came on before the TV show, so we were like, "What's this?"

I didn't say at that time, "Let me renegotiate my contract." I just went on and took the $400 a week they were giving me. Break it down to hours, and it was probably 25 cents an hour, given the time we spent on it.

But you don't all of the sudden work for GM or Ford or whoever it might be on the line and after two years turn around and say, "I want to own the company." You own the company if you buy the company or if you invest in the company. Micky and I were just interested in performing and working. We were actors, playing the parts of rock 'n' roll singers.

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moored1

Well Bob, you've convinced me. After being a Monkees fan for 45 years, seen them in concert several times, bought the CD's, records & DVD's and enjoyed them for all these years you've convinced me. I guess the only thing left to do is throw this material out and ask you, oh enlightened one, to clue me in to what I SHOULD listen to & enjoy. Perhaps I should be given a list of required listening so as not to be led further astray. Come on, man. What do you want? People enjoy this material & have for decades. I'd rather listen to this over Sonic Youth any day of the week!

June 21 2012 at 2:31 AM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
bob

Ok lets face facts, none of the Monkees are real artists in the music biz. Nesmith had the most success but come on he really didn't put much work out there. The Different Drum effort was great but not much else in my opinion. If you remember or have seen the b/w screen tests both Nesmith and Tork wanted that job bad and Nesmith even comments he was a failure during the test, so whoever said he was a success before the Mo(nkees is a bit off. Another thing about Nesmith, if he doesn't become a Monkee he becomes an inheritance in wait because the Monkees although not a huge financial windfall for him initially did allow him to meet the people he needed to that took his career to whatever level you argue. I've read about his nonsensical insightful rants (which he does to this day) he is just a bit off the rocker in my book. He was perfect for the Monkees as a show and I can't imagine anyone else in the role but some of you really need to get him off this pedestal you have him on because honestly.......musically.......he wasn't that great but did have a few good tunes that I can count on one hand. Yet again if not for being a Monkee, we probably would have never heard any of them. Give credit where it's due, all 4 were in the right place, the right time, the right era the right karma whatever you want to call it. It was a special time in TV and music that will never ever be duplicated again and I am glad I got to witness it. The rest of the group or troop are mere entertainers. I am very sorry but Peter Tork is not nor has ever been that great of a guitar player or banjo player for that matter and was way out of his league. Dolenz was an actor, not a good drummer at all, mediocre singer at best. Jones the same a good entertainer with a good voice but no real talent as singers are a dime a dozen. As for his comments on acting (that Nesmith should have spent more time on his acting) I don't think what they did was act it was just a party and they were the perpetual guests every week for 56 episodes. If Jones thinks that anybody acted on the Monkees he was sadly mistaken and if they were they were the worst at it in history! All in all when it was said and done if all three invested wisely those quick 5 years or so would have taken care of most anyone for the rest of their lives and most certainly the following years were kind to them as Monkees as well as their bank accounts. All four were undoubtedly struck by lightning.

May 13 2012 at 10:47 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
Mike Pesole

It happens to a lot of them, no matter if you're playing clubs or "famous"

March 04 2012 at 4:48 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
T

Had more talent than John Lennon. Paul and Ringo were the big talent in that group fer sure!

February 29 2012 at 10:22 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
robches

I enjoyed the music that carried the name The Monkees, but saying the Monkees were a real band is like saying The Archies were a real band. Remember, the Archies went on tour as well.

My understanding is that Nesmith and Tork weren't promised anything when first hired other than their $400 a week to do the show. Once the show/music became a hit they went and renegotiated for musical input - that's the point that Jones was making.

Finally, while not in this interview, the Monkees have compared themselves to the Beatles and the Stones in their quest to be validated as a genuine band.

Regardless of who played what, there is no way to place the Monkees on the same level as the Beach Boys, the Byrds etc. - the proof being that those other bands created their own sound and created their own success and sustained their success fairly long-term (ok except maybe Herman's Hermit's). The Monkees are more like the Banana Splits.

July 21 2011 at 7:21 AM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
1 reply to robches's comment
spacerocker21

Were the Monkees a real band? Yes and no. They did start out as a TV series about a rock and roll band, but then they did become a band with their album "Headquarters." The Monkees had been given the chance to record as a band but as a band before Don Kirshner entered the picture - one big misconception is that he was part of the project from the start. He wasn't. But the Monkees had mixed results on their first efforts.. None of those first efforts pre-Kirshner have ever been released. Kirshner heard them and judged it unworthy and relegated the group to vocals only once he took over. Working on the TV series likely wouldn't have afforded them much time to play on their recordings but it was what they wanted to do. Mike and Peter contributed very little to the recordings as they were underused by the other music producers or not at all. Kirshner could've alleviated the situation by allowing them the right to play on the recordings and letting them pick some of the songs. But, his ego was far too big to let that happen.

The Archies went out on tour? What planet? Ron Dante, Toni Wine and Ellie Greenwich provided the vocals and studio musicians supplied the music but an actual band never existed to tour. Dante and Wine made some limited appearances last year, but Dante was busy as a vocalist and producer (Barry Manilow) while Toni Wine was and is a songwriter.

Regarding what Nesmith and Tork were promised beyond the $400 a week to film the series: All four Monkees plus Bob Rafelson and Bert Schneider acknowledged that Nesmith and Tork had been promised they were to have a say in the recordings and that the Monkees would exist as a band apart from the TV series. Kirshner essentially refused to honor the promises made to them, and as he made a 15% royalty from their recordings, he had a vested interest in running things as they were, which met using Davy (his preferred singer) and Micky for lead vocals and shutting Mike and Peter almost completely out of the proceedings. The music was being passed off as theirs (in addition to Micky's and Davy's) even though they had no say in the matter. That's what they were upset about.

The Monkees, except for Davy, never compared themselves to the Beatles. And certainly not the Rolling Stones. Any comparisons that was made was made mostly by the fans or the press. They wanted to be taken seriously as a band but never as a pale copy of the Beatles.

Granted, the Monkees aren't on the same level as the Beach Boys or the Byrds, but here again, the point is the whole issue of holding it against the Monkees for not playing on their first two albums while giving a pass to other acts who likewise didn't play on theirs. It's a fraudulent and hypocritical argument to accuse the Monkees of being fakes but that the Byrds and the Beach Boys (and all the other acts that used session players) were not fakes because they were too hip. If you're going to hold it against one, you got to hold it against them all.

July 22 2011 at 12:42 AM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
robches

Let's understand what really happened here - and even Davey acknowledges it, if you read what he's saying. The network created a TV show with a TV band - they hired actors - those guys weren't buddies growing up together ala The Beatles or Stones - or even musicians who found each other (like Cream).

They were hired to do a job. Nesmith understood that from day one - he also understood that nothing was guaranteed in all of this - the show could have been cancelled whenever. So he made the best deal he could at the time.

Snagging the B-sides of singles was brilliant. Every time an A side sold - written by Neil Diamond or Boyce-Hart - a Nesmith song sold with it. Brilliant.

The real problem is that one day Dolenz and Jones started to believe their own press releases - that they were a real band and rock stars. The moment they took control of the music the hits stopped coming. Now that's just fact. Mike Nesmith was smart. It was a job.

He understood that working at McDonald's doesn't make you a restauranteur.

And for the record, I am in my 50's and loved The Monkees when they came out - but let's be real - they are no Beatles.

July 20 2011 at 3:22 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
1 reply to robches's comment
spacerocker21

Actually, Nesmith and Tork had been led to believe that the Monkees would exist as a band outside of the tv series. Neither Dolenz nor Jones believed their own press releases and thought they were a real band or rock stars. They were actors first, singers second and musicians third. Nesmith and Tork were musicians first and actors last. They had wanted to play on their recordigns from the start but had been prevented by Don Kirshner's policy that the only thing they could contribute were their vocals.

The Monkees kind of came in through another door as far as being formed. But, what was the difference between the way they formed and other acts that were being put together by managers or record companies or songwriters or producers? That they didn't play on their intial records but so what? Neither did the Mamas and Papas, the Beach Boys, the Raiders, Herman's Hermits, etc. And only Roger McGuinn played on the Byrds's first hit, Mr. Tambourine Man.

Of Nesmith's four songs that were released on a single, one was the B-side of a Neil Diamond song and another was a Boyce and Hart song. And both of his songs made the Top 40. Nesmith's third song, Listen To The Band, was first the B-side to Someday Man, then became the A-side when that song gained more airplay and kids buying the record for Mike's song rather than Davy's song. The fourth song, Good Clean Fun, was the A-side to Micky Dolenz's song Mommy And Daddy, although here again, the record followed the lead of their previous single (Listen To The Band/Someday Man) in that the B-side became the more popular tune.

The Monkees were no Beatles, that's true. Even so, it's not a valid reason to dismiss their musical contributions. The Beatles, like Elvis or Sinatra, is a yardstick everyone seems to want to measure certain acts by, instead of judging them by their own merits. It doesn't make sense to me to do that because every artist is going to end up falling short because all the ingredients are always going to be different, from the songwriters to the vocalists to the musicians (and their musical skill) and the producers.

July 20 2011 at 5:50 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
Suzanne

Sounds like Mike Nesmith was a shrewd businessman & musician

July 20 2011 at 2:59 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
1 reply to Suzanne's comment
mojo

yeah so was his mom, supposedly she invented white-out and advised her son on business matters

July 20 2011 at 6:49 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
wally gee

Actually, Peter Tork was the musical genius , he could play at least 10 different instruments.

July 20 2011 at 12:56 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
Sandi

What a grand time that was for me!

A little older, a little grayer, and a little thicker! "Thanks for the memories"

July 20 2011 at 12:42 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
bpthurber

I promoted Concerts in the mid 70's and had the magical fortune to book Michael Nesmith for an acoustic solo Concert. He had just written and released "The Prison" Album and Book. He mesmerized the crowd in one of the best shows I have ever seen. He talked about the power of thought and sang as he strummed his guitar. Michael is the most positive, intelligent, and interesting person I have ever met.

July 20 2011 at 12:30 PM Report abuse +1 rate up rate down Reply